Question about cost of apostasy

[Maria al-Qibtiyya]

Assalamualaikum wa rahmatullahe wa barakatu!

As we know the cost of apostasy is death penalty. I want to know, is it obligatory to put to death an apostate? There is verse in Qur'an which states ''There's no compulsion in religion'' . And in case, a learned Muslim is supposed to discuss or debate on religion & wants to try to get the truth, but in the end he may decide to apostatize, may find Islam illogical; would it be an obligation to kill him still if there's no any compulsion in religion i.e Islam?

[أبو القـاسم]

أختي الفاضلة مارية ..لا أدري هل كتابتك الإنجليزية بسبب عدم تمكنك من حروف عربية أم لأنك لا تحسنين سواها فسأجيب بالعربية باختصار مفترضا أنك عربية ..
بخصوص الردة : فهي في الإسلام عقوبة إلهية ثبت بها النص الشرعي عن النبي : من بدل دينه فاقتلوه ، وهذا لا يتعارض مع آية (لا إكراه في الدين ) لأن آية عدم الإكراه مفادها ترك حمل الناس على اعتناق الدين بالإكراه ..هذا أقصى ما يمكن أن يستفاد منها في أحد الأقوال في تفسيرها ، ولكن التصريح بترك الدين الإسلامي خيانة لله ورسوله ، فلا يستوي في الحكم مع كافر أصلي ، الكافر الأصلي لا نجبره على الدخول في الإسلام ، والله يقول بعد هذا المقطع من الآية (قد تبين الرشد من الغي ) فالحق بيّن لا حاجة فيه لإكراه أصلا ، ولكن من كان مسلما ثم خان الله بالردة ..فقد أوقع الله عليه عقوبة حماية للمجتمع للمسلم من الاغترار بذلك فيكون فتنة لغيره .وقد قال الله تعالى (والفتنة أكبر من القتل ) وقال (والفتنة أشد من القتل ) ..يعني فتنة الناس عن دينهم أشد من القتل ، وحماية له أيضا لانه سيفكر ألف مرة قبل إقدامه على خطوة كهذا ويراجع حساباته فيكون أقرب لرجوعه وأدعى لتوبته .. لكن هذا الحكم وهو قتل المرتد لا يكون مباشرة ولا يكون مع جميع أنواع الناس على نفس السوية بل يختلف ما بين شخص وآخر بحسب حالته ، ..فيحاجّ قبلها ويبين له وجه الحق بالبراهين ...فإذا أصر وأبى وعاند فحكمه القتل ..وأما افتراض أن تقع مناظرة بين اثنين ثم لا يقتنع ، فهذا فرض متوهم لا حقيقة له في الواقع ..لأن حجة الحق بالغة بينة ..وإنما تقع المكابرة والعناد ..لا غير ..والله أعلم

[أبو القـاسم]

ومن باب التقريب : أمريكا مثلا أو أي دولة لا تجبر احدا ان يحصل على هوية الدولة ، لكن من يحمل الجواز الأمريكي مطالب بشروط ..فإذا وقعت منه خيانة للبلد أو نحو ذلك ، يقتلونه أو أقل شيء يسحبون منه الهوية ..فلا يصح قياس أصل الدخول في الدين على الخروج منه

[بحب دينى]

Our sister Maria : did you understand the answer of the brother by the Arabic languge or you need a translation of his answer to the English language?

[أميمة]

Muslims believe that the words which Allah revealed to the prophets were written down in books. The last book, which was given to Muhammad (صلى الله عليه وسلم) is the Qur’an. The Quran is the only book from Allah which is complete and preserved in its original form
as long as you Choosed to be a muslem that means that you accepted all the rules of islam not some parts only , exactly as you accept the rules of registration in a bank or any company you deal with before you make contract with them , are you sure that you accept eslam??? .

[Maria al-Qibtiyya]

Muslims believe that the words which Allah revealed to the prophets were written down in books. The last book, which was given to Muhammad (صلى الله عليه وسلم) is the Qur’an. The Quran is the only book from Allah which is complete and preserved in its original form
as long as you Choosed to be a muslem that means that you accepted all the rules of islam not some parts only , exactly as you accept the rules of registration in a bank or any company you deal with before you make contract with them , are you sure that you accept eslam??? .

Yes I am a Muslim. But I was just asking a question. Cannot I?
And I cannot write or understand Arabic so I have to write in English.

[Maria al-Qibtiyya]

Our sister Maria : did you understand the answer of the brother by the Arabic languge or you need a translation of his answer to the English language?

No. I think his reply doesn't answer my question completely

[Maria al-Qibtiyya]

أختي الفاضلة مارية ..لا أدري هل كتابتك الإنجليزية بسبب عدم تمكنك من حروف عربية أم لأنك لا تحسنين سواها فسأجيب بالعربية باختصار مفترضا أنك عربية ..
بخصوص الردة : فهي في الإسلام عقوبة إلهية ثبت بها النص الشرعي عن النبي : من بدل دينه فاقتلوه ، وهذا لا يتعارض مع آية (لا إكراه في الدين ) لأن آية عدم الإكراه مفادها ترك حمل الناس على اعتناق الدين بالإكراه ..هذا أقصى ما يمكن أن يستفاد منها في أحد الأقوال في تفسيرها ، ولكن التصريح بترك الدين الإسلامي خيانة لله ورسوله ، فلا يستوي في الحكم مع كافر أصلي ، الكافر الأصلي لا نجبره على الدخول في الإسلام ، والله يقول بعد هذا المقطع من الآية (قد تبين الرشد من الغي ) فالحق بيّن لا حاجة فيه لإكراه أصلا ، ولكن من كان مسلما ثم خان الله بالردة ..فقد أوقع الله عليه عقوبة حماية للمجتمع للمسلم من الاغترار بذلك فيكون فتنة لغيره .وقد قال الله تعالى (والفتنة أكبر من القتل ) وقال (والفتنة أشد من القتل ) ..يعني فتنة الناس عن دينهم أشد من القتل ، وحماية له أيضا لانه سيفكر ألف مرة قبل إقدامه على خطوة كهذا ويراجع حساباته فيكون أقرب لرجوعه وأدعى لتوبته .. لكن هذا الحكم وهو قتل المرتد لا يكون مباشرة ولا يكون مع جميع أنواع الناس على نفس السوية بل يختلف ما بين شخص وآخر بحسب حالته ، ..فيحاجّ قبلها ويبين له وجه الحق بالبراهين ...فإذا أصر وأبى وعاند فحكمه القتل ..وأما افتراض أن تقع مناظرة بين اثنين ثم لا يقتنع ، فهذا فرض متوهم لا حقيقة له في الواقع ..لأن حجة الحق بالغة بينة ..وإنما تقع المكابرة والعناد ..لا غير ..والله أعلم

Thank you for addressing to my question. Can you prove all this by giving any reference? I have watched some videos , where some scholars try to prove , it is a choice to kill an apostate, it is not an obligation. While some people say it was necessary at the time of Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) and now it is not necessary. Some people say apostate should be killed only in Islamic state . Under non-Islamic state they can be left alive. What do you say all about it?

[BStranger]

Thank you for addressing to my question. Can you prove all this by giving any reference? I have watched some videos , where some scholars try to prove , it is a choice to kill an apostate, it is not an obligation. While some people say it was necessary at the time of Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) and now it is not necessary. Some people say apostate should be killed only in Islamic state . Under non-Islamic state they can be left alive. What do you say all about it?

Apostates cannot be killed in non-Islamic states because Muslims are not allowed to take things in their own hands. The only people who can make laws are the Caliph and/or the judge, which also applies to honor killing, but that's another topic. While in a Muslim state, it also depends. There are apostates who you don't even know they are apostates. They can only be killed if they said that they left Islam, and after he has been asked (istitaba). While there are apostates who hurt Islam and spread disorder in Muslim communities, and they are killed. Historically, there were heretics that lived under Islamic rule, and they were not even touched, sadly.

[أميمة]

You said that you can not anderstand arabic , how could you judje that his reply doesn't answer your question completely

[أميمة]

Yes I am a Muslim. But I was just asking a question. Cannot I?
And I cannot write or understand Arabic so I have to write in English.

Of course you can ask question , but you try to tell that this is not fair as you think so, can you answer my question about contract betwen you and any bank or company, as they tell you : if you agree about our conditions we can make contract,then after agreement ,you tried to refuse what you agreed and say this is not fair, this is the reason I asked you if you really accepted rules of Islame as long as you say that you are muslem because this means acceptance of all rules , when you decided to be muslem

[واسطة العقد]

A translation for the 3# and 2# replies
About apostasy, it's a divine punishment authenticated by Hadith from the prophet - pace be upon him - " kill who change his religion -Islam-". This doesn't contrast with the verse " There is no compulsion in religion" becouse the verse means not to force people to become muslims... this is the most that we can get from the verse. However, stating that one will leave Islam is a betrayal to God and his prophet. So its not the same with a Kafir who didnt become muslim, The Kafir who didnt become muslim will not be forced to do so. The verse says next "Truth stands out clear from Error" the truth is clear, we dont have to force people to embrace it. But who was a muslim and then betrayed God by apostasy, God has punished him to protect the muslim community from that so it wont be Fetna -strife- for others. God says in the holy Quraan "The strife is worse than murder" to strife people form the religion is worst than murder.. And it is a protecion for that individual too, because he will think a thousand times before doing that and will rethink many times so he will be close to actual repent. But this punishment - apostasy- is not an immediate punishment, it differs for each one. He will be convinced to the truth by evidenecs before that and will be given all the kinds of evidences and proofs. If he insisted on the Kofir he will be killed.. assuming that there will be a debated that he will not be convinced is a false assuming because the truth and its evidences are clear, what might happen is stubbornness and arrogance.
For example: America or any country dont force people to have its citizenship, but once someone have it he will be required to several things, so if he betrayal the country he will be killed or he will lose his citizenship as punishment. Therfore, there is no analogy between entering a religion and leaving it.

[أخوكم]

In case you don't know, your country doesn't have an obligation to kill apostate. and Abulkasem didn't say it's a choice at all.

[BStranger]

In case you don't know, your country doesn't have an obligation to kill apostate. and Abulkasem didn't say it's a choice at all.

مشاركتي و الله اعلم احتوت على الجواب، ارجو مراجعتها ان اخطأت.

[Maria al-Qibtiyya]

You said that you can not anderstand arabic , how could you judje that his reply doesn't answer your question completely

.sis I have Google transtlation but maybe google translation is not perfect